Pat Hatfield

Fulton said if Empire Catte Ltd. Attorney Mark Watts “turned around and sued, they would get their 600 units.”

 

Again, you state that we will lose the case.

You were wrong Vice Mayor to tell Mr. Meister you never said what you said; you did say it; you said it many times; and if you think you were right or try to intimate in emails that you were on the right side of this issue, then you’re not in disagreement with me…but with your own words that are on the record.

Norm Erickson

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From February, 2006: Adding items to the agenda is not new!

Why I Stay Until the End of the City Council Meetings---AND YOU SHOULD, TOO!!

Attn: Highbanks Marina Residents:

At the 2/15/06 Special City Council Meeting there were only two items on the agenda: the proposed development at Meadowlea and the reviewing of city charter resolutions; however, after the second agenda item was finished, conversations wandered elsewhere as they are want to do. The need for direction on Highbanks Marina’s residents and how much time they should have to get building permits seemed to become, on the face of it, a third agenda item that had not been advertised. Moreover, City Manager Maryann Coursan had actually called in to the Assistant City Manager Anthony Gonzalez to have this issue resolved. When did she call? Could it have been put on the agenda and advertised? If not, then hold it two weeks until the next meeting. I understand that issues need to be discussed and resolved and only in full view of the public; but fairness also needs to be observed and it seemed like this crossed the line.

I felt that this was wrong and went to the podium to say as much. This seemed to be a separate agenda item and that residents from the Marina were not present to give their side of the story and what would be beneficial to their needs and quality of life. Highbanks Marina residents would be directly impacted by this decision that was coming very close to a vote.

This is why citizens need to stay until the end of the meeting because one never knows what is going to be discussed or perhaps even voted on. It is also the reason why a stop time needs to be passed in resolution form, through the city charter, or by policy so that citizens can hear all of the business that the city is discussing that may impact them. If citizens know that the meetings will end at 11pm, then they will stick it out to hear it all; in the very least they will know when it will end. In addition, this also is the reason why the council and staff need to learn how run a meeting. Robert’s Rules of Order needs to be adopted in some fashion as it encourages the efficient running of meetings and has done so since 1893, which, in and of itself, attests to its value and enduring importance.

If you leave early, you just never know what is going to be discussed. This time is was about the Marina residents; the next time, it might be about you.

Norm "the Gadfly" Erickson

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FOLLOWING THE RULES? NEVER...NEVER!!

THE FOLLOWING IS JANUARY OF 2006:

At last night's City Council meeting City Attorney Ardaman stated that the City does not use Robert's rule of order to oversee their meetings. I was taken aback by his response so I look in the City Charter and found out he was right.

What I did find in the Charter was Sec. 4.12. The Council shall determine its own rules and order of business and shall provide for keeping a journal and minutes and votes of its proceedings. The journal and minutes shall be public records. 

I strongly recommend that Robert's Rules of Order be placed in the City Charter so everyone including the Mayor and Council know what is going on. When you make up your own rules confusion is what you get and business is more difficult to complete. We must all stay on the same page.

Lenny Marks

DeBary, FL

 

After reading Lenny's editorial I am left with the following question:

If we're not following Robert's Rules of Order, then what rules ARE we following?

And how would the people know if they (the Council) are following the rules or breaking them?

How would the Council for that matter?

Norm Erickson

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1/13/07:

How to deal with Costa and Watts

If Norm Erickson knows how...that's scary...

This is what I read the council on 1/10/07; we'll see what happens when Costa comes back like a bad sequel...

 

City Council 1/10

           For too long there has been perhaps deliberate indifference toward changing the comp plan to facilitate the negotiation of growth.  Look, regarding growth, you can say yes, no, or lets negotiate.

The first question Costa and Watts should ask - before submitting plans-- is "is this negotiable ?" I don’t know why you would say “yes” after paying good money to win a lawsuit giving you the right to say “no”. Furthermore, I would argue that Vice Mayor Fulton spent too much time negotiating a deal with Watts only to find out his fellow councilmen didn’t want it. Result: the Vice Mayor proclaiming lawsuits that we would lose.  You repeatedly said this in the executive meeting on April 19 th.  Vice Mayor, work with your councilmen not Watts on what is to be negotiated.  The four of you, if you don’t want the Vice Mayor to negotiate with Watts ask him politely not to do so. No one should negotiate anything without first being selected - at an open meeting - to be the preliminary contact/negotiator/information gatherer - who returns to the Council at an open meeting to present all the points discussed. Then the Council can discuss the next steps.   The five of you need to work together and you’re not. On April 19 th in the executive session of last year you ended the meeting in agreement of negotiating with Watts; but you never threw around a number or process of how to negotiate. You then voted the project down.  I’m glad you voted it down but what it highlighted is that you’re not working together or something else is happening not in the public eye. Present a united front; don’t squabble amongst yourselves in front of Watts.

To negotiate growth we need to know what we don’t know about the Costa land which is how many developable acres are there? Until you have that number, talking about 200 units, 600 units or 800 units is misleading and irrelevant. 400 units on 100 acres? On 200 acres? It makes a difference and it defines density. 2.1 units per acre could be anywhere from 200 to 800 units depending on how many developable acres we are talking about. This is the information we need from Costa and if we don’t get it, then we can’t negotiate because we won’t know what type of density we are negotiating. If I hear you guys bandying about unit numbers like 300 or 450 without knowing the number of developable acreage, then I’ll know you’re not doing the job right. If Costa and Watts comes in here with “X” number of units to build and they can’t tell you how many developable acres there are, turn him away. He’s not answering the most important question

In closing: Vice Mayor Fulton was afraid that we would waste a lot of money on a lawsuit that we would lose; if you don’t truly negotiate what is to be built on the developable acreage, then I’m afraid that we’ve lost a lot of money on a lawsuit that we won.

 

Norm Erickson

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12/20/06:

CITY AND COUNTY IMPOTENT

IN BRINGING WATER, SEWER, AND GOOD

ROADS TO RESIDENTS

 

Gentle Reader,

It happened again this morining as I was enjoying my eggs, grits and bacon from 4B's: it takes a developer to bring basic services to the good people down on Fort Florida Road. The article stimulated many questions in this reader's noggin'. To begin, Country Estates at River Bend will be a yacht club down by the river. In order to get a re-zoning they will be required to do things that the city and/or county haven't done or won't do.

First of all, where is all of our tax money going if not for basic roads, water, and sewer for these people? It's not like they want something out of the ordinary or special like a city hall or their own train set that actually moves people; we're talking about roads, water, and sewer. Secondly, when Rosamonda was sitting in the big chair and people complained about flooding in the "older areas of DeBary", he was the first to say, "Well, they knew that when they moved there." No such words are heard about the residents who bought homes at the end of a washboard road; however, something tells me that they were probably promised amenities in the "near future". I'm not for growth, but I agree with the people who want this: the city and county haven't done doo-do for them. Is it any wonder that they want the developers to come in?

Once again, individuals do it better than government. These developers will get done in two years what the city and county haven't in 10+ years. Just like residents trying to salage the massive pots on 17/92. They screw it up, then we have to fix it.

Something else caused me to choke on a piece of bacon: why the hell does a developer pay 500,000 to protect the manatees when our residents can't get clean water for "years and years and years"?!

Moreover, and you gotta love this one, the School District (Red Light District) says that the re-zoning changes ARE premature until a "mitigation plan" is approved. Orwell is smiling from above. Let me see if I can work my way around the Doublespeak here: the School District's "mitigation plan" is a number...with a lot of zeroes. I would compare them to prostitutes but that's not fair to prostitutes because they only sell their own backside not everyone else's. We'll put up with overcrowded schools and learning that is negligible due to overcrowded classrooms if we can add even more money to our 1.3 billion dollar budget. If it walks like one, turns tricks like one, and takes money like one...then it probably is one. This might seem like rough commentary, but if you act like an ass, don't be surprised if people ride you.

After the election this city has access to more money than ever before:

1. Taxes went up 35%;

2. Power Franchise Fee went up 6%;

3. They can borrow money for up to 7 years;

4. They are borrowing 10 million just for stormwater;

5. They are securing grants(taxpayers' money) to pay for projects;

No water, roads, or sewer for years and years and years but we'll be getting our city hall, train station, and skateboard park. What will they do with all of this money?

What we focus on becomes our reality; I wish local government would focus not on their extravagant needs but on residents' basic needs.

 

Norm Erickson