People Over Politics

I hope that everyone enjoys the holidays and hope everyone, as I, look forward to a productive New Year.
Let this New Year start by stoppping the name calling and personal attacks that seem to be oh so common. Enough is enough. There are so many important national issues that will have a profound affect on the citizen of Debary that we need to express our opinions of that instead of what we think of individual people. I want to thank the council and the city for allowing my input on the Street Scape committee and invite more people to come to the meetings so you can have a voice of what to do instead of waiting so you can ocmplain. I hope to be of service to other committees if possible and welcome the opportunity. Let's make 2011 the best year for Debary that we have had in years.

Sure, we ...can talk about Christmas, but let's leave that to the children and to the marketing specialists from Wall St. New York,that capitalize on the holiday by exploiting their parents.

Meanwhile in the real world of December 2010, Santa's Predator Drone Sleighs just delivered more presents of death and destruction in Pakistan to suspected terrorists. Not terrorists, but suspected terrorists, we hate terror as WE dish it out, we hate war, but we LOVE war.

54 killed yesterday and over 100 CIA inspired strikes this year so far, as we spread peace and joy to the world.

Some say our "war on terror" is generating more terrorists than it is eliminating. Did it ever occur to americans that all these people we are killing and maiming in the mideast have mothers, sons, daughters, cousins and brothers that will... never forget?

Shall we kill them all, can we teach them this So-Called Christian peace and compassion with sneak attacks from pilotless drones, are we any better than they are?

In a world of hate and death, we up the ante by delivering more hate and death, we bomb, they bomb, we use high tech sneak killing they choose low tech sneak killing.

We are a nation spending in excess of $500 million per day in borrowed dollars to "guess kill" peasants and calling it a "war on terror". So our terror is fighting their terror at $500 million a day plus all the corpses on both sides

I am sure that Mr.Jesus Christ would approve on his birthday knowing how his teachings have been swept aside in the name of American revenge and paranoia.

Our latest wars are a local issue because it is costing every Debary citizen far more than he realizes. Follow the money, follow the motives..this is a US Government war, not an american war, the enemy we seek is ourselves, as we stumble into another war we have zero chance of winning by any measure.

We have the nerve to celebrate Christmas ,yet never ask ...who would Jesus BOMB?

Ho ho ho. Let's talk about something fun......like Christmas.
I woke up this morning thinking about Christmas and all the other holidays we celebrate here in the US. And then I starting thinking that we DON'T celebrate the days we only use them to get out of work. How many people, given the day off to celebrate 'something' - actually go participate in the celebration for whatever it is? Like birthdays.........an excuse not to go to work. Who really wants to celebrate getting older?? But Christmas that is different. We have totally lost track of what Christmas is all about. Why don't we just make it 'Merry Giftday' and be done with it. Christmas........it's like taboo. Then we would not offend anyone and it would describe what it has really turned into being. A day to receive or to give - gifts. A day the big business waits for all year. A day when people will spend way more than they can afford, a day when we celebrate.................what? Do you even remember???

Mr. Keys......Government thinkers ALWAYS get it wrong. They hear what they want to hear. Your posting addresses 'the law' and how myself and Mr. West wanted to change it. That is what you heard........strange. I made it very clear I was NOT supporting or opposing Mr. West application and my entire concern was why the council could not give him and extension to hear his request AND THERE IS NO LAW TO PREVENT THAT!!!!! You say > Mr.Waldorf: When does order diasappear and chaos begin. I say it probably begins when government stops listening to the people. Granting an extension was not going to 'personally gain' anyone. Your entire posting just rambles on and on about government and that was not even my issue. Give me one common sense, logical answer to this one simple questions..........why could the council not give and extension so Mr. West could present his request??? Do it in 25 words or less. Stay on point please.........if you can.

I shall comment on the last two bloggers comments on 12/4 & 12/3 of this year. especially the comments of an unidentified blogger on 12/3.

This nameless blogger writes "It is apparent that REGULAR people do not know what is good for them and need government to control and restrict their sometimes illegal activities".

Who are these REGULAR people that do not know what is good for them?

I suppose politicians are better than everyone else ,as many lie cheat, steal and manuver their way through government while claiming to represent the people.

Can you imagine a politician actually telling the truth? They are experts at demogogery, which is telling the people what they want to hear and never sacrificing their offices by telling the truth about anything that threatens their office and status.

Politicians always claim to represent the people, forgetting to say they represent themselves and their supporters first, the rest of the people do not neccessarily count.

Again the namelss blogger displays his ignorance with the statement "We all know that gambling is bad". Is this bizarre person serious?

Gambling is a business like any other , it is entertainment, from horse racing to roulette and bingo to the lotto. Gambling is all around us from the scratch off games at McDonald's to the largest gambling institution in the world on Wall St.

Some states counties and municipalites are smart enough to take advantage of the positive side of gambling.

Daytona is smart enough to take advantage of this with the Daytona Kennel Club. The foolish City of Debary passed up this opprotunity, unlike other cities from Monte Carlo to Las Vegas that are making billions on it.

If gambling is bad then we need to shut down the VFW, MOOSE, Florida Lotto and all church fund raisers that include the game of chance called bingo.

What was the role of some of these NON Profit instituions in killing gambling in Debary? We they afraid of the competition, was it all about the hypocrisy of government allowing non profits and religious organizations to profit from gambling? Almost every state in the union allows gambling in the form of the LOTTO...as long as the state gets their CUT.

If you want to talk about comedy, the Daytona Kennel Club had a major laugh as it joined forces with many of the fools in Debary and killed the gambling opprotunity. They did not want the competition nor did the other non profits and religious money hustlers from this common ordinary little town.

This city needs to be pro business and pro job opprotunities. Apartments and houses represent niether in the long term. We need proven successful businesses, not more empty commercial space and empty parks.

I have never met Bob Waldorf in my life, but he seems like an intelligent fellow, especially when he agrees with me.

As far as comedy shows go, just attend a city council meeting and watch the spectacle of government in action, you will need a good sense of humor and a strong stomach.

Mort Culligan

Mr.Waldorf: When does order diasappear and chaos begin?

What happens when the law is ignored or bent to suit an individual who thinks he is above the law?

You and Mr. West are asking the Council - and in effect the people of DeBary - to break the law to satisfy an individuals personal gain.

We are a nation of laws. Laws that work from the largest States to the smallest and to Cities and to every individual. What makes you two think you're special?

It's obvious you didn't take the time to read either the appropriate part of the Comp Plan, our City Laws, the LDC or Mr. Parrot's exceptionally thorough and clear presentation of why Mr. West's request could not be accepted. Add to this the fact that while the Council was ready to discuss the Agenda Item there was no representative from the petitioner in the audience. The Mayor's decision to proceed - backed by the Council - was correct. It's not up to the person who wants to present an item on the Agenda to the Council, to pick and choose the dates, to change them without notice to the Council and to not have a legal representative on hand to protect both parties if decisions should be made. Petitioners do not establish the rules and procedures of a City Council or a City Manager.

You both do a diservice to the Council, the City Manager and the citizens of DeBary when you say the City is against business. What it is against are businesses that do not follow the laws, may be detrimental to the welfare and appearance of a structure and when it is offered as a guise of extre tax dollars for the City.

Are the citizens of DeBary going to close their eyes to the breaking of the laws for personal agendas?

Do they want to go back to the behavior that brought the City close to bankruptcy? I don't think so. You may think this is a sleepy City that can be bamboozled until it is too late. Well, they rallied quickly enough when a CRA was at the door and a few other boondogles that could have cost the City millions of dollars.

There is also a certain amount of arrogance in the manner on which this request was presented. No valid representative on hand. The potential builder - an engineer - was the spokesperson. A request to postpone the discussion until the second meeting in January. Could this be because the new Council members may be more "pliable". Who needs to read what's being built or the rules?

What would have happened if this request was not denied? A Pandora's Box would have been opened for future requests with variations regardless of legality or appearance. Where would it stop? We might as well throw away the Charter, the Comp Plan, the LDC and let "whoever" run rampant.

This is the behavior that brought the City to the brink of bankruptcy. It was saved only by the skill of the City Manager in spotting the financial disaster within a few days after his arrival. However, the behavior Mr. Waldorf and Mr. West support only opens the doors to special interests and personal agendas. This behavior is the antithesis of truth, honor, law and consideration of the public.

We cannot let this happen. It's your City to save or watch it lose all the reasons we live here. Radio commentary doesn't make it all right.

Andrew Keys

There are two guys, Bob & Mort (sounds like a comedy show) that keep writing what Debary should allow. What would happen to Debary if we didn't have the council to set laws and codes and regulations. We need that. It is quite apparent that regular people don't know what is good for them and needs government to control and restrict their, sometimes illegal activites. We all know that gambling is bad, except for the State because that is a government entity and it knows what is best for us.

I mean really - why would we want a horse track that would have people coming into our town with lots of money that they might spend here. I agree with the council, lets build high rises ( 5 floors I think was the height discussed) and put apartments up on the top three floors. Now that is a great idea and shows that the City cares and wants to house people and the citizen that live in the areas with those vacant foreclosed houses - well that is just too bad. Debary wants progress and can't be concerned about vacant properties - we have code enforcement to deal with them.

The council, with the mayor making the final vote, decided to not listen to an appeal by a business owner (Shotz Sports Bar) here in Debary because HE was not present to ask for an extension. However the council did have an extension request by one of his associates that was putting together the proper information to make an infomred presentation as to why his request should be approved. Granted he should have been there and there is no question about that. But...here we go again setting a tone about the City against business. Why could the city not granted the petitioner an opportunity to present his case? What were they afraid of .....or is it really the mind set of the current council that '' they have the power '' and if you are good you will get and if you don't do what they want - you will not get. The issue of Shotz was nothing more than a small Debary Downs issue. THEY DIDN'T UNDERSTAND IT!!!! You make judgements without having FIRST hand knowledge. Mr. Parrott tried to compare SRX licenses to 4 COP. I been in the bar business. I know the difference. What experience does Mr. Parrott have to know the difference? He said, > they must not sell much food <. Does he go there enough to know that? Has he ever been there? I want to thank Mr. Lenzen and Mr. Hunt for sticking up for 'a citizens right'. Mr. Hunt had the right compromise - a postponement until the next meeting. I could go on and on but I will say the BEST until Monday Night. IF you want to hear what I really think listen on Monday night to www.bobindebary.com.

Many Debary citizens do not like Gambling, so let's examine what DEBARY,FL has lots of and does like...... NON-Profit Corporations.

There are at least 45 of these so called Non Profits taking in the money right under our noses. CHA CHING!

Just type 4 words in any search engine ...NON PROFIT Organizations Lookup.. then search 32713...

According to the Melissa Data.com website for Debary, Fl 32713

Sunshine State One Call Inc. has $6,103,174 in assets and made $4,818,110 in annual income...NOT BAD for a non profit!

How about the READING EDGE Academy inc $4,770,807 in assets with an income of $4,410,050...again this is non profit.

One of my favorites is Gateway Center for the ARTS INC. which has $2,566,317 in assets and an income last year of $1,512,422. Go GATEWAY, not bad for operating out of a DEBARY CITY PARK...rent free? OVER $1.5 million, not bad until you find out whose pockets it came from.

Of course there is Debary's own Christian Care for LIL Angels INC. which somehow earned $507 thousand dollars last year.... not bad for those LIL Angels was it!

The VFW raked in $548,898....go VETS!

Florida SAFE.....$436,906....go SAFE, whatever that is?

Family Motor Coach Association iced down a cool $189,930 according to the Melissa website....GO Motor Coaches !!!

This list only includes 3 religious franchises (churches)of which none claimed they earned anything.

There are 1.4 million non profit organizations in the USA...can you imagine their yearly non profit...profits?

Okay, I admit it, I am jealous.....I wanna multi million dollar non profit business too.

Mort Culligan

For years I have been trying to get the City of DeBary to do something about Mirror Lake and I get pushed away. Simply said, I have absolutely no confidence in the City of DeBary since it's inception. All I hear is talk, mostly about how they want to develop. Citizen's seem to be pushed aside. We were better off when we weren't incorporated. I have more faith in Volusia County. At least there you can talk to some one, and they get things done for the citizens...

I want to tip my hat to Mort Culligan for being the only one to post anything on here about common sense and logic when it comes to the city and gambling. I praised Mort on my radio show and I want to do it again. There are a LOT of seniors I talked to when campaigning that would much rather have a place to go sit, mingle and play a little game of chance. It is a lot better than watching grass grow. Government needs to get out of my life period. I believe there are a lot of people that believe the same way. We, us 'seniors' have done a really really good job, fighting wars, raising kids and making this country great now leave us alone, enjoy what we created and we will go gamble. Your comment is welcome on my radio show but just remember mine is always right. :)

Bob Waldorf

I happen to know that www.debarypop.com doesn't always post everything that gets submitted. That's one of the reasons why I'm hesitant to invest much time in putting anything together which may contribute to a constructive dialogue on your site only to have it get buried in your cyber backyard.

Your heavy-handed editing has created the perception that this is Norm, Lenny and John's forum. That's all well and good but gets old after a while.
It's probably why two other sites have popped up where folks can represent all sides of an issue.

Trust me, I know it's difficult to let postings through that are radically different from your own and even to have them unfairly criticize you but that's vox populi - if you've got a beef with it then address it rather than quash it.

Nelson

We've let in practically everything. There were some emails about Fulton and Long that did not make it through. A couple of weeks ago a citizen made some allegations about a candidate that ran for office and it was confusing and baseless; I suggested that it be more specific and nothing came back. If there is something else out there, let me know. So, yes, things have been held back. But not insults against Norm, Lenny, or John or John's family for that matter nor other viewpoints. Angie's criticisms, Meister, et al., are all on POP.

As far as my writings on POP: I use POP. I'm free to express my opinions as are others. I thank Nelson for making me aware of what others are saying; however, I can't control those comments that may or may not be true.

UPDATE: Below is the email that I referred to above. I'm still not sure what it all means but maybe I was wrong to "hold it back" and ask for more specifics. I apologize. It was sent in by Bob Waldorff:

I have to respond to the following comment because that is just the way I am. But first read it 'again'.

4. Lastly, why is this article even in the newspaper, who got it going and who called the paper? What was that phone call like? “Hey, Mr. Harper…have you heard the latest?” “No, what?” “Well, Mr. Kolba is really busy. He’s got lots of irons in the fire.” “Holy involved citizen, Batman…we can’t let that go by.”

Hmmmmm.....let me give ya something to think about. This example is backed up by facts but who am I to say -'what it means'.

Recently 'my past' was a big campaign issue, but how did it get brought up? Here is one possibility or is it '' just a coincidence'' hmmm...boy wonder - what do you think?

Before I was able to get my past out 'on my own' I was sent an email from someone via my web site who asked me if I was (and they copied and pasted the section from the web site) the person described from 1991. Before I responded I checked to see if they were a registered voter and found that they were not. One day I did a name search and traced them back to being on the school board where my opponent was a memeber. Hmmmm......coincidence??? I never responded. Later I got another email, which I took as being less than positive, and after doing some searching found that person was a 'facebook' friend of my opponents but they didn't sign the email by that name and wasn't bright enough to change the name the email came from. Hmmm...another coincidence??? But then how would my opponent know about a 25 year old past? Hmmmmmm......maybe my X son in law, who lives in Orange City.........is that possible????
I guess we never know what some people consider 'dirty politics' because I was told over and over that neither of my opponents would play 'dirty politics' so it must be a coincidence because the other option is this person plays 'behind others back'. Hmmmmm.....

It appears that the last two bloggers are using this forum to sit in judgement of the character of Council memeber Chris Carson, when that is not the subject.

The fact of the matter is that he has the council seat and he cannot possibly please every voter on every issue, everytime.

I strongly disagree with many of the council members votes on some issues and agree with them on others, but they all deserve a certain amount of respect for putting up with the citizens of Debary,Florida.

I happen to like ex mayor Coleman and ex council members Marks and Erickson, all seem to be decent people, I just happen to think they blew it on the gambling opprotunity.

While back on the subject of Gambling, the largest gambling institution in the world is located in Manhattan, it is called the Wall St.Stock Exchange. When people buy stocks they are gambling that the stocks will make them money, however they prefer to call it investing.

People have won and lost more money on Wall St. than they ever have gambling on main street and that 'game' is less regulated than Las Vegas.

I have seen ZERO legitimate arguments against gambling in the community...lets have some.

How about some of then NON PROFIT...NON TAXPAYING organizations out there? Where are these non profit profiteers as they HUSTLE and BEG money from the community yet claim a non profit status?

How many NON Profits are there in Debary...do the research from the relgious organizations to the arts center hustlers....many of them opposed a TAX paying gambling organization that would have provided jobs as they remain tax exempt.

Does Debary need more tax exempt semi-socialist parasite organizations or does it need tax paying successful capitalist businesses that would provide entetainment and job opprotunities?

P.S. I wrote to Mort telling him that Citizens' Editorials are open for any and all discussions. Also, we have a "National Issues that may impact DeBary" link as well. While the topic of gambling coming to DeBary in the near future is always open for comment, so are any other comments you want to see on YOUR website. All you need to do is send it in.

During the period when both Chris and Maryann supposedly served the City, I noticed that he did not excel at free thinking. Rather he followed her lead like a puppy. Always doing as she said and not considering other candidates for the City Manager position when she was hired. In fact it can be seen on the Council meeting vidoecam tapes that Jack Lenzen would jab Chris in the arm to wake him up during Council discussions. Far from being the "silent asassin", Chris was the "napping legislator".

Joe Braxton

I'm not feeling too secure with the new City Council. We all know Chris Carson voted "yes" the last time. I can't believe he's changed his mind. If this should come up again, I would rather see it placed on a referendum, than have the City Council simply voting on it. That would be the fairest and most HONEST way to go about it. Let the residents decide the issue! If that happens, I think we all know which way it would go ... down the tubes!

Living happily in DeBary, which is special to me.

No GUTS, NO GLORY.......No Risk, No Reward....Why are the people of Debary afraid to change?

You want to talk about crime, that is caused by a lack of jobs and opprotunities. Debary needs businesses that are successful, provide jobs and pay taxes.

It is easy for retired people that live on government checks to forget.....OTHER people need jobs. They need jobs so they can pay taxes to keep this country going.

It is easy for old retired people to say NO to everything and accent the negatives as they forget, other people have to make a living and that means job opprotunities.

That is the problem with Debary it is stuffed with old people that live in the past and live in fear.

I lived on the Mississippi Gulf Coast, they legalized gambling and we all watched as the Casinos brought millions in new tax money for government and plenty of excitement and entertainment.

Propery taxes went down as the casinos went up and their was no real increase in crime. Security is tighter at gambling establishments than at your local police station.

Face the facts, people like to entertain themselves thru gambling and what are people really afraid of anyway?

Gambling Addiction....you gotta be kidding. Some people will abuse anything, you cannot regulate human folly. What about people that are addicted to food, what are you going to do.... outlaw food?

The City of Debary could be a city with a bright future, not an old folks home full of 'knee knocking nelly belles' that live in fear.

Historians say that 'change is the essence of survival', if that is true then Debary should have a shriveled up dinosaur on its city logo.

Remember.....Columbus took a chance, he did not stay at home and worry about negatives and grasp for reasons why he could NOT do something.

Again, Debary needs to grow up and wake up, this country was built on capitalism, not on bogus non-profit organizations.

Morton Culligan

It's an invitation for crime, addiction and many other negative's. More people are hurt than helped by having it nearby.

Be honest.... gambling is already in Debary, it helps pay for the State of Florida's childrens education thru the Lotto and various scratch off games.

Those that are opposed to gambling should voluntarily pay extra taxes to offset all that evil gambling money. I do not think these anti-gambling people would never do something that HONEST.

If you don't like gambling you should stay out of gambling establishments such as Winn Dixie and your local Convenience stores.

Church groups and other 'so called' non-profit businesses often use forms of Gambling as fund raisers. Granny is a gambler at the church, VFW, MOOSE bingo game ,just as much as if she were slinging dice in Las Vegas.

Now lets cut out the BULL shall we.

Gambling establishments are opposed by religious organizations NOT for moral reasons so much , but for economic reasons.

Pastors, Preists and other Witch Doctors do not want to see people putting money into the slot machine, when they could get that same money in their collection plate.

Non-Profit Groups from your local Jesus Hustlers to your Arts Center constantly hustle for MONEY...MONEY and more MONEY, the jackpot they are after is your financial support, they see gambling as a threat to their CASH FLOW.

The foolish leaders of this city recently turned down a good economic opprotunity that would have paid taxes and provided entertainment and jobs, they folded when they should have gambled.

Non-Profit organizations are all about the money, yet pay no taxes, gambling establishments are HONEST enough to be all about the money and admit it and share it.... by paying taxes.

The people of Debary need to grow up and wake up, this country is still capitalist and Debary could use the entertainment, jobs and tax relief that a gambling establishment like Debary Downs would have provided.

We have enough tax exempt, hypocritical money hustling organizations in this city, at least Gambling Establishments pay taxes.

Gambling is good, it is losing that is bad, but it is part of the game. If people do not like gambling, just do not gamble. simple as that.

There is nothing special about Debary Florida at all, it is just another small city of people afraid to change and afraid to take a chance.

Morton Culligan

This is the worst case of deja' vu I've every experienced. I certainly hope the new City Council has a clear recollection of what happened the last time this issue raised it's ugly head. The residents of DeBary sent a loud and clear message that they don't want gambling/gaming or whatever fancy name you want to give it in our community. Also, why would the City want to do business with a bunch of thugs who, when they didn't get their way, filed a lawsuit against the City. Also, just curious, did they ever reimburse the City for the costs of that special meeting? Bet not!

As I asked before, do our new City leaders want to leave this as their legacy?

"GAMBLING IN DEBARY...WHERE DO THE CITIZENS STAND ON THIS ISSUE?"

Where do I stand? Here is what I understand as the meaning of gambling:

"Gambling is the wagering of money or something of material value (referred to as "the stakes") on an event with an uncertain outcome with the primary intent of winning additional money and/or material goods." From Wikipedia.

If that's the case, the City and Florida already allows gambling. Lotto, Bingo, Internet "services", etc... Think about the tax benefit of the horse track and the card room if it came to the City? We missed an opportunity to negotiate a percentage of earnings + taxes to go to the City. Plus, negotiate the roads and infrastructure cost to be covered and if people are worried, extra law enforcement officers. Oh wait.. If SunRail comes, people from Seminole, Orange, etc.. would have taken the rail to the track to spend their money. Ok, I'm off my soap box, but wow did we missed out, especially in this economy where counties, cities are cash strapped, not to mention jobs that would have been created.

The 3 members of our household would cast a vehement "NO" vote on gambling! Don't need it, don't want it, have no use for it!
If you need to gamble drive to Tampa or Daytona, please!!!!

Please add my email address to any list to fight against it please!

I, for one, do not gamble. Do I judge others for gambling? No, that's their choice. Do I think that by bringing gambling into our area that the seven plagues are going to be cast down upon us and all kinds of sin and depravity will spread through our community like wildfire? No. That is silly, closed-minded thinking. I used to live in an area that had a gambling establishment and it brought in thousands of jobs and tens of thousands of dollars in tax revenue. These areas are higly regulated by the government, it is not a gambling free for all. They have strict regulations when it comes to who can gamble, where they can gamble, who can drink (and where and when)and how much.If you don't like to gamble, then don't. But at least reap the rewards of those that do.

Debary seems to be struggling to find an identity. Outside of the Walgreen's store I have seen very little comercial development, and that obviously effects the tax base. We are still the bedroom community, but we act as though we want to be so much more. While I don't envision Debary becoming the next Las Vegas I don't see where having a casino or gambling establishment are detrimental to the city. I don't buy into the rhetoric about increased crime rates, or about creating a bunch of gambling addicts. I say we should at least keep our options open.

Well, it's almost over. I just want to thank Councilman Lenny Marks and Norm Erickson for everything they have done and tried to do, in moving DeBary forward. You will most certainly be missed. I can only hope and pray that the new council will continue on with the programs and changes that the current council has started but, I have to say that after listening to them, I seriously doubt it.

I, Bob Waldorf, host of Bob in Debary on the internet radio show hereby GUARANTEE's to predict the winner of the up coming City of Debary council seat elections. And the winner is: THE ONE WITH THE MOST VOTES.

And that my friends is a guarantee. Remember you read it first on Debary Pop the 'all knowing' for the city of Debary.
(what is life without a little humor?)

Debary Citizens;

Re; The latest Debary Newsletter, there they were on page #1, most of our council members and 'liberal spender' Rep John Mica cutting the ribbon on the Debary flood drainage project.

They never mention one thing about the COST of this project to innocent taxpayers and the fact that those houses that flooded out, should have flooded out. Many of these houses were built by people that wanted to be near water and they got the water they deserved.

This project is just another government bailout for people that were nieve and foolish enough to buy or build on low land.

Our greedy governments permitted the submarine housing because for tax profits or whatever other finanicial gain was available.

Speaking of LIBERAL SPENDING how much did innocent taxpayers have to spend on our multimillion dollar Gateway Center for ARTS and POLITICS?

Liberal spender Rep John Mica was at that grand opening as well, he is a skilled politician, wasting tax dollars on a needless ARTS clubhouse for mostly retired people that are a drag on the working taxpayers. As our nation drowns in debt, Debary must waste millions on such a disgraceful extravagence such as an ARTS CENTER.

Many politicians claim to have conservative VALUES yet vote to LIBERALLY waste billions to fund their pork barrel PET PROJECTS.

Our politicians voted to involve our nation in two mideastern revenge wars that are costing the USA from an estimated $500 to $700 million a day... every day.

That is LIBERAL SPENDING at its finest , hundreds of millions a day in borrowed money, every penny borrowed from our bleak economic future.

As our federal politicians keep bringing home the PORK for 'feel good' local projects and war businesses, they seem to forget, how long has the Washington DC. Federal HOG been dead.

We are borrowing from the future for our obscene extravagence of today. There will be a day of reckoning, that will be part of our future as well

This is in response to Norm Ericson's comments on your web site. He is completely off base and is merely speculating that this story was reported by a candidate that is running against Mr. Kolba. No one except homeowners of Debary Plantation would have access to the information reported. Several of these concerned homeowners, including myself, had initiated the call to the newspaper. We have had many serious issues that have been a major concern to us and we simply wanted Mike, as President, and his "Magnificent Seven", as they called themselves, to take proper action. Since they had not, we felt at this point, the only solution to reach out to the homeowners was to solicite the help of the newspaper.

Since you have no clue as to what goes on with our Homeowners Association,I wish you would keep your comments on what you know as factual. You wish to run negative remarks about Mike's opponent, do it on your own convictions and not assumed that Mike's opponent had anything to do with this publication. Incidentally, we feel that Mark Harper's article contained no libel or slanderous remarks. We simply wanted to report facts and we feel certain that we did.

It is so disheartening to hear people run their mouth off with such negativity. It would be so productive if we could hear positive solutions to the problems facing not only our local government, but our national government as well.

Sincerely,

Lillian Mesmer

If no one but homeowners would have access to the information as you claim, why was Chris Carson the lead quote in the article? Also, I didn't comment on what was happening at your Homeowner's Association...my comments were aimed at Mr. Carson and the article which was obvious in its intent: smear Mike Kolba and reach for anything to do it.

As for it being disheartening to hear negative comments, I agree. Perhaps you're not aware of two incidents that have happened to me in public at City Council meetings: I was verbally threatened by the Mayor. No one had a problem with this. Fine. It taught us that it can be done and no one has a problem with it. In addition on August 4th of 2010, John Wilson - co-campaign manager for Nick Koval - insinuated that I'm a racist against Hispanics. In fact, John Wilson - co-campaign manager for Nick Koval - insinuated that Lenny Marks, Lita Handy-Peters and Jack Lenzen are all racists as well, which is pure humbug and I defend the honor of all three of my fellow council members.

My wife (maiden name Martinez) who was born in Mexico City and my Hispanic step-daughters and daughter were disheartened to find out I may be a racist - I wonder if John Wilson - co-campaign manager for Nick Koval - was aware of my Hispanic wife, step-daughters and daughter before he threw the old "I'm not sure racism's not a factor" card.

However, no one...no one has stepped forward to say that this kind of insinuation is wrong and not wanted; therefore, I feel well within my rights to voice my concerns and the facts and some biting commentary of my own given that I and three fellow council members have been smeared with the word "racist" and no one has spoken out against it. Since no one has a problem with such irresponsible language at the podium and on the record, I don't see why I should hold back on facts and my commentary which falls far short of what John Wilson and the Mayor have said with no repercussions from anyone at any time.

No, I can not be moved by your protestations and what's more is that I will continue to be outspoken using the facts as my foundation with biting commentary to follow. What I said was fact mixed with appropriate commentary and it didn't go toward the issue of the HOA but, rather, the article as a whole and its very existence as well as comments made by Chris Carson which are false. I do thank you for writing in to POP.

I was happy to note that the City agenda online now includes the summary pages from the agenda package. That is a wonderful step forward in getting more information to the public. Thanks for thinking of it!!!

Joe Braxton

I want to thank each and every one of you for calling last night to let the people know your position on the issues. We had 62 people listening. During the last two weeks I had 89 people go listen to the previous show in the archive to listen so we are getting listeners.

I do this show every other week when the ‘council’ is not meeting. I will keep doing the show after the election to report on how the new council people respond to the citizens.

I do get email from voters asking me questions, like I am going to call you and ask you, so I think you should consider being available to call in on the Wednesday nights the show is on. I do believe the ones that do not call in are losing a good opportunity to get in front of the voters to answer questions on the minds of the people.

Thank you all again. Good luck to all of you and I hope to hear you again on: www.bobindebary.com

City polotice in Debary have become a real embarsement to me, as a resident. I can only hope that while all the hot heads were pushing for there, own personal agenda, I belive they may have lost focus of the cost that this is going to cost,US, in a long term the real long term affects of this ciould mean for our children/grandchildern.

To the City Manager:

Please get the code enforcement officer, building official and planner for the City to throughly

investigate ALL of the illegal signage in the City for which no action has been taken to remove.

Council:
After the fiasco with the sales office in the country club in which the building official issued permits

without checking with the planner, because as he said at a Council meeting "he is not a planner",
He should be terminated by the City Council as the contractual party with the consulting firm. They

are no better than GAI was. We all know what a poor selection they were. Get rid of stroop the easy

way, call the consulting firm and ask for him to be replaced immediately before he makes even

more mistakes either through ignorance of the City Code or by direction from someone at City Hall.

Joe Braxton

Thank you Norm for saying some of the things we have been thinking about Wilson What-is-his-name

and Roberto (not legallyBob)Garcia -whatever. Weaver's treatment by the City is a black spot on its

integrity. Too bad Ken Weaver did not choose to take several citizens to court for defamation to his

character via the internet. Maybe they would have learned a lesson about keeping their mouths shut.

When is someone going to get a legal determination abou the name "bob" uses and the one he was

legally give at birth??? Can he legally sign City documents with a name that is not his? Someone

9/2:

Just a quick note to thank you for posting the hurricane interactive map. I find it the best source of information when there is a hurricane looming nearby.

Also, I would like to thank you for bringing up and explaining the other side of issues. Too many times the issues are not fully explained and rumors spread so fast. Or, some people will write in and argue non-issues to deflect the true issues.

Thanks again for your incite on the issues that pertain to DeBary.

J. Brown

********************************************************

To everyone!

Please call the supervisor of elections and sign up now for absentee voting in November. It is as quiet and peaceful as your home, you can vote whenever you feel like it (even 3 2.m.), and it is EASY! You do not have to be out of town on election day to qualify. It is wonderful. I have been doing it for over 5 years and would not go back to precinct voting. Why not try it......

Joe Braxton

8/29:

As the parents of Ryan Rinaldo, we would like to express our gratitude and thanks to all involved in the pass primary election for our beloved city of Debary. Along with Ryan, we met some great and fantastic people. We learned that we are surrounded by a caring and passionate community. We are so proud of our son as you could imagine, and feel extremely blessed. As a young person who has grown up in our city he has always felt the need to make a difference!

Thank You
Rob & Anna
(Dad & Mom)

8/26:

I would like to take some time to say that I did have the pleasure of getting to know Bob Waldorf during the election. He and Debbie are extremely nice people and Bob seemed dedicated to the cause of making DeBary a better place. What happened 25 years ago is very old news. The problem is that old news makes sensational stories.

I feel for you Bob because I too had to endure this type of situation.I had been involved in a "not so proud moment" over 25 years ago and it too came beck to haunt me. Luckily I had time to react and ended up with a respectable showing with Mr. Van Conoley.

I know for a fact that The Four Townes Moose would never purposely sponsor such behavior. Keith Bradshaw has always expressed nothing but kind and curteous words. Please do not judge a very good philanthropic organization such as The Moose because of a few people who run wild with a story.

You have nothing to be ashamed of and you ran a very good campaign. Keep active because DeBary needs active people. This was not to be your moment but in time, you just might reach and grab that brass ring. Cream rises to the top. Keep a stiff upper lip and keep on doing the posive steps that did get you to the dance. Think nothing but positive and produvtive.

Catch you around Bob

Mark Meister

****************************************

Once again Mr. Erickson chooses to knock the Mayor! Will you never learn? It is as plain as the nose on anyone's face that you have a bug up your rear about the Mayor and it shows at every council meeting, and in every word you put in your web site. What a shame! One thing I noticed about the resent election, NO ONE that attacked a candidate won. hopefully you will learn something. It is hard for an "illiterate" as myself to believe a man that is suppose to be so smart and educated can be so stupid when it comes to life and people as you are! Your words are like a knife you cut deep and ruthlessly, just like 90% of your people that write in your citizens editorials.....Oh and jonh & kathy rumbley I would rather spell a word wrong than to be a critic as you are. I did not know I had to be a spelling bee champ to respond to anything! I can only hope when I grow up I will be as perfect as you are. Once again debary pop please quit trying to divide the city in 1/2!!!!!
What are you trying to insinuate about the mayors name? Angie Dobies

**************************

Angie,

I feel sorry that you can not see the light for the bad spelling. Your ideas are worth discussing, if not action. If you acted rationally, maybe we would listen to the ideas that you have. Calmness is better than hysteria.

Joe B

********************************8

Please JOE B do not feel sorry for me my life is wonderful even if I misspell a word here or there. I will not judge you as you judge me I have read some of the things you have commented on, you have been a little "ENTHUSIASTIC" yourself. If me misspelling words is what worries you I feel sorry for you. I guess when you feel passionate about things it over flows. I guess you would get the point of my writings if you read them instead of grading them. Please remember NONE of US are perfect.
"QOETE" Congressman Mica & Mayor Garcia" They stress the importance of "GOVERNMENT COOPERATION" in getting the west side project done so quickly. Also Mr. Multari said "Mayor Garcia was on top of everything (whose home is in the debary golf and country club where the some of the flooding was) without him, the community would suffer more." This is what makes a good Mayor of course POP does not want to comment on this stuff they would rather criticise someone! Once again please let's stop dividing the city. Angie Dobies

8/24:

Chris Carson, do us a favor, if you win it this time, don't just nod and agree with everything the Mayor says, ok? Like you did with Mayor Coleman? Very odd!!!

John and Kathy Rumbley

p.s. To Lenny, Norm and Van ~ Thank you for a job well done!

p.s.s. To Angie: Yo, Angie ~ take a pill! By the way ~ learn to spell!

8/19:

John what in the world are you talking about!!!! I only got one thing to say, MR. PARROT works on the direction of COUNCIL not the other way around. The council is put there by the PEOPLE!!!!!!!Please get your eggs in a row. I thought YOU where going to retire I guess that is a LYE! who is the LIAR now. PLEASE do this city a favor a shut DOWN all of you. All you, Erickson, Marks, and Connely do is spread nonsense please quit trying to divide the city!!! And if my format or wording is not correct TOOOOO BADDDDD! May Debary POOP rest in peace!

Angie Dobies

8/18:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/21/AR2007092102074_pf.html

This is an independant 2007 study on just the IRAQ WAR! Could the figures be close?

Our government's ugly revenge is costing us dearly......we are not a rich nation anymore.

Time and expense guarentee our total defeat in these wars.

The economic weight of our platimum and gold plated military machine will buckle our knees and we will crawl home in a cloud of excuses and lies just like Vietnam.

We do not support our troops , we exploit our troops by sending them to attack and occupy nations where they will be picked off day by day, week by week and year by year, until we stagger away totally humiliated and defeated by our own stupidity.

Our troops are not fighting for their country at all, they are blundering and sacrificing for their corrupt government.

You people like to hear what the citizens of Debary think, this war is a disgrace, just ask Rep John Mica, he helped start it.

8/16:

Dear public employees & politicians

Thats right..go look at the tiny cheap building for the Debary POLICE...look at it.

Now look at our $2 million new city hall..check it out....a modest building considering government.

Now look at out MULTI MILLION dollar extravagant Publically funded Debary ARTS CENTER....go ahead...go look.

It appears that our minority group of ARTS CENTER HUSTLERS out rank both the POLICE and the CITY. Who cares about police and government...we have the ARTS!

Now the so called ARTS CENTER is being used for political purposes with its meet the candidates arts show! Is the DCA spinning their influence by having a political forum?

Perhaps the DCA can beat some more money from the unemployed , and retired people of the city by influencing future council members votes.

Maybe the Debary Center for the ARTS can squeeze more money out of our council members, as they turn their back on the working taxpayers for the extravagence of the ARTS .

I can remember all the city hall meetings where the Debary Center for the ARTS begged and hustled for money and our disgusting politicians gave it to them.

A group of 400 arts hustlers beat the taxpayers out of millions for their arts center, from all levels of government. This group seems to be always hustling for MORE MONEY and influence in city government.

I laugh at our Gateway JOKE Park as it is dominated by our new political/ arts center and money hustling venue called the Debary Center for the ARTS.

When will our politicians ever begin to stand up to all greedy special intrests as they rip the taxpayer at city hall and beyond.

Do any of you have a total on how much money The Debary Center for the ARTS has cost the taxpayers over the years??????? Clue...it is in the millions.

Do the authorites or citizens of this community have the right to look at the books of this non-profit organization infecting our public park?? Or are we just going to keep throwing money at them thru ECHO and the taxpayer?

This DCA Non Profit organization that has plauged this city since 1998 and has NEVER to my knowledge, stopped groveling and influencing for more MONEY from the unrepresented taxpayers

Morton Culligan

Taxpayer and voter

8/13:

Mr. Garcia,

If you truly care about this city, resign. You are tearing this city apart with your antics and public displays of martyrdom. I was at the meeting where you started yelling "Bullshit!" several times. This is not the type of person I believe should be mayor of my city. You have alienated the council and the city manager - who has brought this city up so much from the mud that it was steeped in. If you want us to get better and succeed, step down.

It is obvious that we can no longer focus on the advancement of the city because we have to constantly hear about you not having your own office, when no other elected official was granted one either. Your contradicting comments regarding this matter is reason enough for you to take a step down and truly question your motives and actions, which, from my perspective, just seem like a cry for attention and a crusade for power. Please, leave us in peace.

Sarah Edwards

&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&

Political Signs...When is enough, enough,,, Well the citizens of DeBary are not allowed to put up any kind of sign, but, it's all right for all those running for office to trash our roads with their political signs. It's bad enough that DeBary is the laughing stock of Central Florida with the Mayor issue now we are known as TRASH CITY!!!!!! You Can's see the grass for all the political signs. It looks like it's "Dont Do AS I Do DO AS I Say"Why can't you people find one central spot and put up one sign for each candidate instead of trashing our town with hundreds from every candidate???????

John Walters

DeBary

8/13:

Listen to this, EVERYTIME it is NOT what YOU want to hear you ATTACK every issue. The fact is the PEOPLE came out to speak to the council and they did not LISTEN! I'm not going to write a Novel like JOHN & NORM did ,but please WAKE UP you guys are in LEFT field. Please quit trying to divide our city. I for one can not wait for NORM & LENNY to get out of office then HOPEFULLY the city government can serve the PEOPLE like it is suppose to! Happy retirement to all of you at debary pop. POEPLE OVER POLITICES could not be further from the truth. OH! and please quit calling everybody LIARS.

Angie Dobies

8/10:

The MAYOR or should I say King of DeBary

I am a property manager who manages a nice condominium community in Winter Park. The City of DeBary has become the laughing stock of the area. I have been asked several times "Don't you live in DeBary with that idiot mayor who has been on the news lately?" This must by far be the most embarrassing episode in the history of DeBary. The Mayor comes across as an uneducated buffoon. It also amazes me that anyone in this city is supporting him and his efforts to control city hall since I wholeheartedly believe that that is his agenda. It appears that his comments have now made it virtually impossible for him to get along with Mr. Parrot which is detrimental to the citizens of DeBary. I still cannot believe that a law suit did not come out of the Weaver debacle where again the mayor continually put his foot in his mouth. There is only one solution to this problem in my opinion and that is that the MAYOR must go. I therefore respectfully request that Mayor Garcia resign effective immediately. There is too much work to do to have to worry when the Mayor will embarrass DeBary again, because HE WILL. Resign Mr. Garcia and maybe we can elect someone whose ego already is in check.

On a side note, I am disappointed in Lita Handy-Peters support of the office space. Before I make my decision as to who I will be voting for, I would like to see an explanation from her on this site as to why she supported the Office space. I would also like to see additional information from all 11 candidates on this web site.

Tom Nance

******************************************

Since I first became involved with the goings-on in DeBary, specifically the DeBary Downs fiasco, I became aware of how important Norm Erickson and Lenny Marks are to our City, and of course Mayor George Coleman! If it had not been for them ... I hate to think of how our quite little town would changed into something none of us wanted. All I can say is that I for one (of many) will greatly miss the voices of reason on the Council. I hope Norm, Lenny and George will come back to the Council and be our safeguards.

My very best wishes to you three, and the "old sage" too !!!

Shirley Horchler

8/9:

It is a great public service to all residents of DeBary that the candidates' Campaign Financial forms are available on debarypop. I would like to thank debarypop for this public service. MaryAnn Conoley, DeBary resident

From Norm: Truth be told, I stole the information from the debary.org website. Thanks, Barbara!

8/5:

DeBary City Council votes no office space for mayor in City Hall

He will take it to the governor, Mayor Garcia says

By Pat Hatfield
BEACON STAFF WRITER

Aug 5, 2010 - 2:57:40pm

By the time the Aug. 4 meeting began, the City Council Chambers in DeBary City Hall were full with more than 100 people in attendance.

Faces of the City Council members were tense. Mayor Bob Garcia's voice quavered a bit as he opened the meeting.

He lost the fight over office space in City Hall on a 3-2 vote.

Friends and supporters who filled the chambers shouted at the City Council, promising, "You're out of here," and, "All of them are out."

Vice Mayor Norm Erickson said when he brought up the subject during the July 21 meeting, "All I said is, this is my opinion."

Other City Council members could have told him to "take a hike," he said, but they shared his concerns.

"It's not personal; it's a principle," Erickson said.

During the July 21 meeting, the council voted 4-1 to instruct staff to draw up a resolution prohibiting any elected official, including the mayor, from having a physical office space at City Hall.

When it came up during the Aug. 4 discussion that Garcia has asked to attend staff meetings, that, and Garcia's comments only solidified Erickson's opinion, the vice mayor said.

In a city-manager government, the City Council, including the mayor, does not direct the employees or their activities. The city manager is the only employee the council hires or fires, or directs.

City Manager Dan Parrott said he denied Garcia's request to attend the meetings.

Parrott said his role is not to get involved in politics, and he didn't like being put in the middle.

He said all the City Council members come into City Hall, including the mayor.

"Is he a little enthusiastic? Yes, he is," Parrott said.

Council Member Jack Lenzen said, "We did not evict the mayor from City Hall."

Garcia moved out of City Hall July 22, before a vote was taken on the resolution. He talked to residents and newspeople from his pickup truck and from DeBary Diner and the local Veterans of Foreign Wars post.

Allan Gochal, who owns DeBary Diner, came to the Aug. 4 meeting with a list of 200 affirmative signatures responding to the statement, "If you want DeBary's mayor to have an office."

"We the people want an office for our mayor," he said.

Angie Dobies said she too, had a list of signatures in support of putting the mayor back in City Hall. She would collect more signatures to get the question on the ballot this fall for the voters, if he should not get back his office, she said.

Garcia still had access to facilities and meeting space at City Hall, Lenzen said.

But, Lenzen added, it's dangerous to let policy makers get involved in daily operations and co-manage the city with the city manager.

"I'm accountable," Garcia said. "I know my role. The council does not know theirs."

He said the mayor must be proactive, and he wanted to give people back their government. The council does not have the authority to dictate what he does, he said.

Garcia said the role of the mayor in DeBary is changing as the city grows, and the mayor has to be more proactive. He just wanted to sit in on staff meetings to understand what's going on, he said.

He called DeBary "my beautiful city," and its residents "my people."

"I belong to you, and you belong to me," he said.

The vote was 3-2 to approve the resolution prohibiting elected officials from having offices at City Hall, Erickson, Lenzen and Council Member Lenny Marks voting to approve it, and with Garcia and Council Member Lita Handy-Peters dissenting.

Garcia said, "I believe this violated the rights of the citizens of DeBary."

He said it is a constitutional issue. "I will take it to the governor," he said.

On Aug. 5, Garcia told The Beacon the City Council violated the will of the people who elected them, and he wants to get the governor's direction on how to proceed.

Garcia said, "If I had the authority, the power, I would get rid of them all and hold a special election."

The governor is the only one who can remove the council, he explained.

"I don't need that council for direction of the city," Garcia said. "I preside over that council."

Garcia said he will take it to the president of the United States, if the governor doesn't help him, or he will request a congressional inquiry.

He believes Parrott should have backed him up at the meeting.

"From day one, he knew his role, and I knew my role," Garcia said. "I gave him a complete perspective of what the city was."

He doesn't think Parrott showed him loyalty.

For now, though, Garcia said he was taking a two-week vacation, to regroup. "I'm still going to be out there, working with my people," he said.

Garcia said he will resign if the governor finds he's done anything wrong. If he doesn't get things resolved to his satisfaction, he will not run for re-election.

8/3:

From the Deland-Beacon:

DeBary’s problems easy to fix

posted Jul 29, 2010 - 10:37:28am

Let’s hope the DeBary City Council can soon get its priorities straight.

Service to the citizenry is a good thing. It’s even more important than petty jealousies, personality conflicts and grandstanding at public meetings.

The mayor of DeBary has been using an office space inside City Hall. He’s also had a few gatherings, which he called Mayor’s Round Table Meetings.

These activities are good things, providing significant service to the residents of DeBary. The office at City Hall gives residents a place to meet with the mayor they elected to represent them in city government. The round tables provide a comfortable atmosphere where residents can air their concerns about city government.

So, why did the other four City Council members vote in unison against Mayor Bob Garcia to halt these activities?

Well, actually, for fairly legitimate reasons.

They objected to the office because having Garcia working there could confuse residents about the charter mandate that prohibits the mayor or other elected officials from interfering in the day-to-day operation of city government.

They objected to the round tables because the gatherings weren’t legally noticed as official city meetings, creating an open-government problem for other City Council members who might want to attend.

Yes, these are legitimate concerns. They are worthy of discussion at a public meeting, and they’re also fairly easily addressed, without the drama of a City Council shouting match, or the embarrassment of booting the mayor out of his City Hall office.

To preserve the public service Mayor Garcia was providing, DeBary needs only to take a couple of sensible measures:

First, make office space available for all City Council members to use when they want to work or meet constituents at City Hall.

As far as the problem of members of the public being confused about the power these elected officials have over day-to-day operations, the DeBary City Council could actually view this as an educational opportunity. If a visiting member of the public asks an elected official to walk down the hallway and fix a problem, the elected official can explain how the charter spells out the chain of command.

If City Council members know and respect their roles, this won’t be a problem. If the visiting citizen really needs to meet with the city manager, not an elected official, the elected official can explain that and help arrange the meeting.

As for the Mayor’s Round Table Meetings, they need to be legally noticed, so City Council members can feel free to attend. If residents attended these meetings, they obviously were important to the residents. It may be less intimidating to a resident to attend a “round table” than an official City Council meeting.

Fulfilling the basic requirements of the public-meeting law is a minor burden DeBary should gladly shoulder, for the occasional round table.

8/1:

Yet again Robert Garcia has embarrassed the city. His antics on TV channels 35, and 9 were humiliating. He should be ashamed of himself.
Previous mayors worked effectively without an office in City Hall. He doesn't need one either. Combined with these town meetings of his, he is trying to circumvent the city manager form of government and the rest of the Council.

Bob, listen for once with your mouth SHUT.......... DeBary is a city manager form of government, NOT a strong mayor form of government. If you do not understand the difference, as the City Attorney to explain it to you in small words !!

And speaking of ashamed.... why was the video and audio of last week's Council meeting not available to citizens over this past week-end???? The City staff should be ashamed of themselves as well. Do they do anything productive for the citizens? Whoever is responsible should be fired. But of course that won't happen because the City Manager is out of the state all week.

Joe Braxton

From Norm:

City Staff has no way to control when the webcast is put on the website. The company that does it dropped the ball...although it was frustrating to see so much reported about a meeting so few actually witnessed.

I wish to say a special and heart felt thank you to Norm and Lenny for their service on the Council - it has been a couple of years where I can sleep soundly knowing that people who have "the best interest" of the citizens of Debary at heart are carefully reading all literature before voting on it and making wise decisions. Of course I am talking about Norm and Lenny and the best part about them was that neither was a politician nor had any political motive when ever they made decisions - they did what was BEST for our City after carefully making sure ALL facts from ALL sides were addressed. I did not always agree with their decisions, but knew that they were doing the job to the best of their ability.

There are a couple of candidates in the running that I feel will do the same and the rest just scare me!!!!! I guess it will be a time to once again become a watchdog for the City to be sure things run smoothly and fairly.

Again thanks Norm and Lenny for your service

Gretchen Ganas

It does appear after googling Ms Handy-Peters name that the council has made a good selection. Now that that is settled, I agree totally with John that Lenny and Norm should change their minds and run for re-election. We need you guys!

Norm & Lenny,
Thank you for your service to our City. I personally feel that you have really made a difference, one that I hope future council persons will continue,in investigating the issues that come before council. You have "raised the bar" for future council members, and now our City will be better run because of this.
I wish there was a way to convince both of you to reconsider running for another term. Take pride in knowing there are many who appreciate your accomplishments.

The following is a letter to debarypop.com. +++ I spoke at the second City Council meeting in Jyly, 2010, to defend my good friend, Norman Erickson. Some people in DeBary continue to state that Mr. Erickson uses his website, Debarypop.com to promote his own political agenda. These people frequently state that a person who is not a registered voter or a property owner is simply a pseudonym used by Mr. Erickson. I refuse to believe this. +++ Coincidences do happen. One coincidence happens to be a gentleman named Eric Blair. Eric Blair writes in to debarypop to praise Mr. Erickson and to tell everyone that Mr. Erickson is wonderful and is doing a great job. Now it turns out that therte is no registered voter named Eric Blair. There is no property owner in Volusia County named Eric Blair. Also it turns out that Eric Blair is the real name of the author George Orwell. It also turns out that Mr. Erickson teaches George Orwell as part of his duties as a teacher of English in the Seminole County School system. +++ Mr. Erickson's critics use these coincidences to to state that Eric Blair is a pseudonym used by Mr. Erickson. I can not believe that a man of the People. like Mr. Erickson, would do such a sleazy thing!! For indeed if Mr. Erickson were using his website in such a manner, then he would be no better than those scurrilous individuals who defamed Mr. Ken Weaver after Mr. Weaver was selected to be City Manager. R. "Van" Conoley, DeBary resident
aug 1, 2010

Well, it seems current council stands at a deadlock. I found myself sitting in a council meeting last evening most underwhelmed. On one hand I had two men whose personal ethics and process of governing I admire….and As Mark Meister pointed out with his usual zeal and misinformation ( he stated incorrect facts with regards to the selection process)….they supported me as their first choice. On the other hand we have two council members who seem intent on putting a previous councilman in the seat.

I have to question WHY? After 6 weeks on the job Mr. Parrott reported last night that our city faces budget issues due in part to the manner in which this city and previous management, as overseen by previous councils, has approached our finances. These two gentlemen have both stood up in support of past management even though their actions have on some levels have been (as Mr. Parrott himself said last evening) a disservice to the city and the taxpayer. Many things have been done improperly in our city in the years past. In fact, Mr. Parrott used the word dysfunctional several times last night to describe some of the past staff procedures and financial reporting…and yet our Mayor and Councilmen Lenzen were intent on appointing a past seatholder to the vacant seat …..hmmmm….

I turned in a complete 5 page outline answering every question council had asked with honesty and detail. I felt that information would give council insight into the job I would do. For any one interested in reading it, a copy is at City Hall. In fact, the Mayor commented on the excellence of the packet…….

I spoke last evening only because I was “called out”, if you will, by Mr. Meister….I spoke in a manner that reflects the approach I take. I also had a fact…an actual recorded vote made by me on EDAC that truly reflected my process of sorting information.. I voted not to un-entitle from a program that would PAY OUR CITY roughly $56,000 annually just for being in an entitled status. The EDAC as a whole voted to approve a recommendation to council to un-entitle from the program in the effort to try and secure larger sums of money that today are not even available…This, by the way, is the recommendation previous City Manager Courson was seeking. Minutes and discussion for those meetings are public record as well. She herself did not want to bring this matter to council so she went to the EDAC to do it for her… Council agreed with my vote and voted unanimously to not un-entitle…..They to felt it was foolish to give up assured money to our City with the forecasted economic times looming. Why does this matter?….It proves with a fact, my ability to put the taxpayers’ interests first…

After all…. our elected officials did not take EDAC’s recommendation because they felt it was not in the best interest of our city. Nor did I….

After I spoke…the names were selected….and to no surprise the only two names not from a previous council mentioned were myself and a stellar 18 year old young man who no doubt will have a bright future ahead of him…..

I want to personally thank Vice Mayor Erickson and Councilmen Marks for their support and belief in my ability to do a good job for our city.

After discussion, our Mayor spoke highly of my enthusiasm and good efforts on our current EDAC as his reason for not voting for me. That’s sad. It says to me …do a good job in our City as a volunteer and you are not Council material because it’s a shame to pull you from a committee……hmmmmm……Councilmen Lenzen simply stated he had heard I was going to run for a seat in the upcoming election and he wouldn’t allow himself to put up a person running for a seat to give them an advantage at election time……Okay…

Although I enjoy the committee and find the work worthwhile, I feel my efforts would be better spent on the Council.

I have 40 signatures and an election packet not yet turned in…THEY WON’T BE.

We are losing Vice Mayor Erickson and Councilmen Marks …they have chosen not to run…yet they are the Councilmen who championed for change and accountability….change needed clearly by the audit done after Ms. Courson’s removal from her job as City Manager. Our forensic audit outlined several areas of concern not addressed by previous paid staff or the past Council that oversaw them…we as a city are lucky to have Mr. Parrott on board….by the way, if left to Mayor Garcia and Councilmen Lenzen our previous Assistant City Manager to Ms. Courson would have had the job as City Manager, despite his lack of the requisite credentials….and if that had been the case, would this city have seen these needed changes?….I’m grateful Mr. Parrott sits at the helm of our city…..he already has proven what Vice Mayor Erickson and Councilmen Marks had been saying all along with regard to procedures and policies of paid staff….

I am sorry that Vice Mayor Erickson and Councilmen Marks are not seeking re-election….perhaps this upcoming year when they are no longer serving the residents of DeBary we will wish they were…..

Perhaps in 2011 people will urge them to reconsider and run again for one of the three open seats.

As for me…I will continue to volunteer my time on several levels of non-council related endeavors…..I will live each day with gratitude just because I woke up to feel the warmth of the sun and celebrate the miracles found in daily life. I will give of my time and talent with the same enthusiasm and the desire to leave this world having given more than I have taken….

I was disappointed to hear that Norm and Lenny have chosen to not run again for Council. Guys, you are needed as much as ever!! Please reconsider............

On another note, when is the City going to remove that billboard illegal sign for the Moose Lodge located on Steve Costa's property at the northwest corner of Dirksen and Benson Junction Road. Just because the mayor is a moose member does not mean that they do not have to obey the City sign regulations!!! What an embarrassment to the City!!!

I think that Mr. Nance is right about not appointing someone that the good people of DeBary voted out recently. I also think that we should put someone in there that does have experience at budgets and knowing the people of DeBary.

I think Chris Carson would fill the position perfectly and considering the fact that he works with a budget every working day. He has never lost an election and shows good logical reasoning skills. He knows the people of DeBary. Why limit our thinking to just bringing in a woman for the sake of being different and fill the position with a person with the best qualifications for the position?

Farmton is a terrible plan considering the water problems we will be facing in the very near future. A city right in the middle of our aquafer does not make sense. I believe in smart, reasonable growth and this isn't a very wise move.

Mark Meister

I just wanted to take this time to say that I have officially withdrawn my name from the list for Seat 3. I have a minor personal issue that needs to be addressed and I have full intentions of running in the election for Seat 3 this year and if need be next year. This personal issue will be taken care of by election time and petitions for City Council Seat 3 will be handed in very soon.

Mark Meister

THE PEOPLE WILL DECIDE THE DIRECTION OF DEBARY IN 2010!

Good Morning:- The article on Commuter Rail where the reporter asks
various people if they would ride the trains and they all say yes. Excited to get on a train, etc. But they were never asked how much they are willing to pay on a daily basis.

There is no doubt that mass transit is required in Central Florida. In fact, it is needed in all of Florida. But at what cost. The politicians and developers are licking there lips to get going and no one is seeking the truth about what the taxpayers share is going to be. Where are the millions and billions going to go? There are already millions that have disappeared in the effort to convince the public how wonderful these trains are going to be. What happens after they get off at a particular station? Build a bus depot to get them closer to where they work? How many buses? Cost per ride? And on and on.

Yes we need it. But we need an honest presentation before commitments are made for fancy locomotives, stations, etc.

Maybe an in depth article is needed on POP. You're the Rail Guru. What say you?

I can't outdo what John came up with up there. But I do have a question: when Ray LaHood or John Mica leave Washington D.C. and come down to Florida to tell us to ride the train, do they fly or take Amtrak? A ticket on Amtrak from D.C. can be as cheap as 97dollars. A high of 127 was found. From D.C. to Ocala it can be 108. These are all contingent on dates, of course.

And, of course, one leaves at 3pm on one day and gets in at 10pm the next day, but since these and other individuals are telling US how great mass transit is and how WE should ride and pay for the train, I think that question is a fair one.

I do think Mr. Parrott will be a very good City Manager for DeBary. He has done well for towns that he has been with. This was a very good move for this City Council.

I also would like to wish Ms. Blissett well in her future endeavors. She has also served the City and it's residents well. A job well done in a very tough environment.

Mark Meister

Perhaps Mr. Conoley should serve as both a council member and our city manager as it seems there is nothing he is not an expert on.

Respectfully,
Dave Chapman

While I do respect and agree with Mr. Connolly's opinion about the Interim City Manager circumventing proper procedure, I do not agree with his publicly chastising her last night during the Council meeting. He very astutely pursued the issue to find from where the procedure had been deviated. However, he should have reserved his comments to her for a private meeting. They are all professionals and a certain decorum should be observed amongst them, especially during Council meetings. Perhaps this was a result of the former City Manager having carte blanche, and Mr. Connolly wanted to make sure we all knew it won't happen again.

On a different note, I am happy to see that the Council will pursue amending the LDC or Comp Plan to make it untenable for any gambling establishments in DeBary. Why can't the City mandate a 5-mile "setback" from any residential area, school, park, hospital, etc? That would pretty much shut it out.

Anyway, keep up the good work! You couldn't pay me enough to do what you all do!!!!

I learned a heart-breaking lesson when my father died a few days before Christmas 1987. I never made an opportunity to tell him to his face that I loved him and that I thanked him to raising me to be a good person. I vowed to not make this mistake again with other people that I knew. Which leads to my purpose now.

Many people in DeBary are not aware of a special person in our community. How many really know what kind of a man John Likakis is?

John is at least 80 (but of course keeps his mysteries) and one of the most low-key people I know. He doesn't raise his voice or turn red in the face over events. I wish that I could be like him (except for the over 80 part)!

He is a veteran, a family man, a good friend, and an active founding member of this website. He attends almost all City Council meetings and a lot of others related to DeBary and its governing. I do not know a man who spends more unpaid time loving and caring for his community than John Likakis. I wish that I could be more like him!

I have never heard John speak negatively about anyone. Maybe he was raised to hold his opinions to himself or maybe it is his kind and gentle soul that stops him from hurting people. I really wish that I could be like John!

While you are keeping us on our toes, John, I want you to know that you have changed my life for the better. I want you to know it NOW while you and I are here.

I suspect that John will not want this comment posted on Debary POP. I hope that Lenny and Norm will do it anyway. People in town should know John Likakis just a little bit better. Please tell him what you think now. Don't wait! As I learned the hard way, life really is too short not to tell the people that you care about how much they mean to you.

John, you are a dear and caring friend and so very much more! I hope we will all be together for many years to come - in DeBary!!

Anita

1/4/10

In my opinion,honest,and intelligent people DO NOT want to run for public office. They detest the politics of pleasing private interest groups or individuals over the majority. Think about this when the never-been-to-a-council-meeting people announce for a council seat.
I also think that the same applies to city/county manager candidates. What sensitive person asks for that kind of abuse?

When the City Manager candidates are interviewed later this month, the loud-mouth,ignorant people who made Mr. Weaver's contact with DeBary a living hell on the internet should keep their mouths tied with fishing line and their butts firmly planted in their barco-loungers! Or vice versa, if that options applies to them! They have nothing valuable to share with the Council in making a decision. This includes Mayor Roberto Garcia who may be congenitally incapable of keeing his mouth shut and his opinions to himself.

I hope that Mr. Weaver will hire a "junk yard dog" lawyer to take on the people who ruined his repuation on the internet and Roberto "Bob" Garcia for his public comments about Mr. Weaver. All were uncalled for in that situation. Go sue them Mr. Weaver !!!!

Instead we should be working to make 2010 a better year in DeBary. Grow up and start acting like a mature City; get your house in order and do what the residents and businesses need to grow and prosper.

Joe Braxton

it is only hours away ( 30 HOURS AWAY IN FACT ) I HOPE AND PRAY WE CAN HAVE A WONDERFUL AND BLESSED NOW NEW YEAR IN DEBARY..lets all work toward that goal.. ....

I wonder why it is that approved minutes of the DeBary City Council metings have not been posted on the City's website since May 20, 2009? That is OVER six months of NO City provided detailed info on Council meetings !!! What is the City Clerk doing with 40 paid hours a week if not preparing Council meeting minutes for Council review and adoption? It is a sad state of City government that citizens can not go online to read Council minutes !! What is Miss Tebo doing? Ask the interim City Manager to kick some staff butt and "get it done". NOW.................

CITIZENS' EDITORIALS